The Last Jedi Thread (with Spoilers)

The last I’ll say about Johnson’s love of Star Wars is that the examples I used were just that: Examples. The film is rife with dialogue, cinematic, and thematic references to the other films. Clearly it didn’t work for some of you but it wasn’t because Johnson wasn’t a “real fan”.

 

Looper was great, a breathe of fresh air for scifi at the time. Really don’t know how he got from that to TLJ.

The high point for me through both movies has been Adam Driver. The pursuit of Sith is not evil, it is strength by any means. Watching the intense conflict within Kylo in trying to live up to those ideals elevated the portrayal of Sith on film. It took it from what had previously been caricature to humanity at an extreme, with a great deal more nuance.

 

There actually is a time travel element in Rebels, the animated series that recently ended. I find it hilarious that some have demanded that Kathleen Kennedy be replaced with Dave Filoni, because if Filoni greenlit a SW film with time travel in it everyone would be grabbing their pitchforks and torches.

 

Why am I getting flashbacks to spwath claiming black panther was racist against white people with all this "SJW" talk.

Star Wars was not ruined by SJWs. The franchise has never had a good track record. They have only had 2-3 good movies. TLJ has issues because the writing and narrative is just not very good, in typical Star Wars fashion. Some of the casting choices were bad too. No not because "ZOMG the SJWs are ruining everything!".

 

Its not even the SJW stuff that I was talking about, but you do have have that, then you need to satisfy disney, you need to market to kids to sell toys, but it can't have too much kids stuff or it will piss off these people over here. It ends up being a movie that's being pulled in a hundred different directions even before they have a plot down. That's what I was getting at when I said what I said about trying to satisfy everyone .

I dont know thats how it seems to me at least.

 

You know, reading this thread, I was too.

 

Star wars was ruined by top executives at lucasfilm and rian johnson with their utter incompetence. They also happen to be sjw's. Causal connection is desputable, but in my oppinion likely. That's it, almost under 20 words, saitama would be proud.

Now, when I say ruined, not for everyone, obviously.

 

Honestly when someone uses the term SJW I disregard the rest of what they are saying. A few people here are an exception as they’ve articulated more nuanced views and use SJW as a shorthand term. But for the most part when people use SJW it’s a way to invalidate and shut down people whose views and values do not align with the person using the term, and that’s not going to lead to a productive conversation.

 

That saving the day thing was the single lamest thing in TLJ. The Astrally-projected fight, and then dying from being exhausted was so f'ing stupid it boggled my mind. So utterly unsatisfying.

 

If we're being inclusive, why not include a cross - species romance? Hahaha.

And I have to agree with @purr1n, I can put up with a certain degree of message pandering in my movies, as long as they are executed well. That being said, TLJ is a structural mess with some cool scenes outweighed by many more poor choices (flying Leia, Finn unable to sacrifice himself)

 

The term (originally coined by proponents) has become a perjorative that covers a wide range of beliefs, but commonly it’s like the flip-side to the alt-right. I don’t think that kind of neo-tribalism is especially healthy since it becomes an almost religious mania where dissent to the orthodoxy is tantamount to heresy.

What Marv said about TLJ was on point, there are valid criticisms that have nothing to do with the casting (which I generally like). Characterization, plot, etc. is what this conversation should be about and leave the politics elsewhere.